[Sun Jan 08 09:01:08 PST 2006] GINAT

Welcome, everyone, to Cyber Macro chat

[Sun Jan 08 09:01:24 PST 2006] GINAT

Today's topic is, "Why do macrobiotic people get ill?

[Sun Jan 08 09:01:44 PST 2006] GINAT

In other words, does a macrobiotic life style guarantee health?

[Sun Jan 08 09:02:04 PST 2006] GINAT

First of all, we have to ask, "What does it mean to be macrobiotic.

[Sun Jan 08 09:02:25 PST 2006] GINAT

Let's get some ideas...anybody?

[Sun Jan 08 09:03:33 PST 2006] klara

living consciously, with goals

[Sun Jan 08 09:04:24 PST 2006] GINAT

Who's gotten sick out there, and why do you think you did?

[Sun Jan 08 09:05:28 PST 2006] LInda

I was very angry, and started to eat a lot of vegetarian junk food....plus a lot of cheese

[Sun Jan 08 09:06:00 PST 2006] Vic(Q)

I think a very good understanding of yin and yang is the prime ingredient for health, do you agree?

[Sun Jan 08 09:06:00 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

vic, what do you mean by this? How does a good understanding of yin and yang create/support health?

[Sun Jan 08 09:06:59 PST 2006] ardis(Q)

My question is: after going on a healing diet are we more susceptible to illness than before?

[Sun Jan 08 09:06:59 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Ideas, anyone? Are we more susceptible, or more sensitive to conditions that would otherwise be masked?

[Sun Jan 08 09:07:13 PST 2006] Vic(Q)

What about the mind/body connection?

[Sun Jan 08 09:07:13 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

What about it? Give some ideas, Vic

[Sun Jan 08 09:07:21 PST 2006] Vic

I think it's all about choices, choices in food, lifestyle, friends, etc... yin and yang is everywhere in your life, it all has to do with balance,

[Sun Jan 08 09:07:25 PST 2006] Cool_Dude

Maybe macros get sick because they are arrogant thinking the can eat anything because after all "I'm Macrobiotic! Therefore I can eat anything without any consequences!"

[Sun Jan 08 09:07:53 PST 2006] Vic

that's the Supreme level, and we're probably not there yet

[Sun Jan 08 09:08:33 PST 2006] sally(Q)

I'm not sick now, but would like to know what to do to continue being healthy

[Sun Jan 08 09:08:33 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Sally, let's talk about what health is in order to know how to maintain it. What does it mean to be healthy?

[Sun Jan 08 09:08:41 PST 2006] Cool_Dude

And maybe when we think we are there, we are not there, yet!

[Sun Jan 08 09:08:51 PST 2006] milli

I think that very few 'macro' people get it right - they are often more unbalanced than 'normal' people

[Sun Jan 08 09:09:12 PST 2006] klara

or more worried about it than normal people??!!

[Sun Jan 08 09:09:20 PST 2006] ardis

Cool Dude has a good point. Macros think they know how to balance, so an indiscretion can be righted by a remedy or eating something on the other extreme.

[Sun Jan 08 09:09:36 PST 2006] Vic

Because it may take years to get it right

[Sun Jan 08 09:09:47 PST 2006] jane(Q)

It seems to me that the lack of macro snacks is a major problem in making reasonable choices in real life.

[Sun Jan 08 09:09:47 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

So now we have to address cooking issues. What other problems do people encounter?

[Sun Jan 08 09:10:50 PST 2006] Borya

It's not all about just cooking

[Sun Jan 08 09:10:56 PST 2006] deb2000(C)

shalom all, perhaps because planning meals takes so much thought, so much mind energy, so much of our conscience...it is draining?

[Sun Jan 08 09:11:05 PST 2006] .

Encountering people, now that's a problem!

[Sun Jan 08 09:11:33 PST 2006] Borya

your lifestyle, sleep, mood

[Sun Jan 08 09:11:41 PST 2006] GINAT

Let's talk about the idea of supreme judgment being somewhere far away

[Sun Jan 08 09:11:42 PST 2006] Borya

it all relates to being healthy

[Sun Jan 08 09:12:52 PST 2006] GINAT

What is supreme judgment? How do we realize it? Is it a distant goal?

[Sun Jan 08 09:13:16 PST 2006] .

Hey you guys! Supreme Judgment is over here! Not over there::!

[Sun Jan 08 09:14:18 PST 2006] klara

no goal is accomplished just like that - that's for the instant society. We go up, down and hopefully more up than down

[Sun Jan 08 09:14:19 PST 2006] hazel(Q)

what part does genetics play

[Sun Jan 08 09:14:19 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Genetics is what we call constitution. It makes a big difference in healing. But we still need to address basic questions. Let's stay on track here. What is health?

[Sun Jan 08 09:14:43 PST 2006] lillian(C)

what do you mean by supreme judgment?

[Sun Jan 08 09:14:45 PST 2006] Mamie

Sometimes it seems to me that relying on Michio or Herman, may his memory be a blessing, or ideas of what is good, healing food and what is unbalancing food can take us away from our own ability to make judgments. Makes life complicated and "health" a goal instead of a present condition that ebbs

[Sun Jan 08 09:14:51 PST 2006] klara

being fully alive?

[Sun Jan 08 09:15:20 PST 2006] LInda(C)

I find that the food I eat most certainly affects my level of judgment

[Sun Jan 08 09:16:44 PST 2006] lillian(Q)

I do not understand what you mean by health and supreme judgment

[Sun Jan 08 09:16:44 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

OK, at last. What is health? What is supreme judgment? Let's just focus on this for a moment...responses?

[Sun Jan 08 09:16:56 PST 2006] sandra

Health is the ultimate freedom..it allows us to do everything else.

[Sun Jan 08 09:17:09 PST 2006] Vic

Right on

[Sun Jan 08 09:17:11 PST 2006] milli

We must not rely on Michio or Herman, but rather embrace their experience and suggestions and then experiment and practice for ourselves. Listen to YOUR body and then adjust accordingly.

[Sun Jan 08 09:17:18 PST 2006] Vic(Q)

If we all strive towards supreme judgment, it then becomes a lifestyle, rather than a "diet"

[Sun Jan 08 09:17:18 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

so, back to, "What is macrobiotics?" A diet? A lifestyle?

[Sun Jan 08 09:17:22 PST 2006] Borya

being able to take control of your life by achieving balance with nature

[Sun Jan 08 09:17:25 PST 2006] Mamie

I like the idea that "health" may be "Wholeness" Which doesn't necessarily mean macrobiotics if that leads you to feel separate from yourself.

[Sun Jan 08 09:18:55 PST 2006] Vic

As noted throughout the years, "macrobiotics" is different for everyone

[Sun Jan 08 09:19:06 PST 2006] Cool_Dude(Q)

Where do feelings fit in the world of judgment?

[Sun Jan 08 09:19:06 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Macrobiotics is, clearly a life style. So it includes magic bullet foods, genetics, emotions, ideas....and supreme judgment, among all the other levels. Let's talk about that part.

[Sun Jan 08 09:19:32 PST 2006] lillian(Q)

Health is balance for me.. It is an every day condition and it is not only about what I eat but how I feel and both seem to be quite connected. It is not a permanent state

[Sun Jan 08 09:19:32 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Very good!

[Sun Jan 08 09:20:12 PST 2006] klara(Q)

Does separate from yourself mean being not honest?

[Sun Jan 08 09:20:12 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Nice question. How can you be separate from yourself? Of course personal dishonesty is a separation...

[Sun Jan 08 09:20:33 PST 2006] sandra

Macrobiotics for me is a discipline that is structured so that I can begin to see the whole picture. It is a looking glass.

[Sun Jan 08 09:21:04 PST 2006] Cool_Dude(Q)

Is macrobiotic a means of judging, not just ourselves but everything including other people?

[Sun Jan 08 09:21:04 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

We talk a lot about levels of judgment....yet it's not a kind of judging and criticizing. I prefer to call them levels of consciousness.

[Sun Jan 08 09:21:32 PST 2006] LInda(C)

Health is feeling balance in one's life

[Sun Jan 08 09:21:51 PST 2006] ardis(C)

Health is not a static condition. I imagine that being healthy is feeling joyful and alive in one's body and emotional state. As Alex Jack said in a class: We are either going toward or away from health.

[Sun Jan 08 09:21:59 PST 2006] Cool_Dude

Levels suggest discrimination, "I'm better than you because I'm on a higher level! or "You'll do what I say because I have higher judgment than you!"

[Sun Jan 08 09:22:04 PST 2006] Vic

Levels of "judgment" was a word coined by Ohsawa, I agree, levels of consciousness sounds much better

[Sun Jan 08 09:22:11 PST 2006] Vic(Q)

Quality food is where it's at -

[Sun Jan 08 09:22:11 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

so what do you do if you don't have quality food???

[Sun Jan 08 09:22:51 PST 2006] Vic

How can you not have quality food?

[Sun Jan 08 09:23:25 PST 2006] ardis(Q)

Macrobiotics gives us the tools with which we can take responsibility for ourselves on all levels.

[Sun Jan 08 09:23:25 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Let's talk more grounded here....what are the tools? What does it mean to take responsibility. And most of all--why then do so-called macrobiotic people get sick?

[Sun Jan 08 09:23:31 PST 2006] klara(C)

Lead me not into temptation!!!, Vic!!

[Sun Jan 08 09:24:07 PST 2006] klara(Q)

We talk about the levels of consciousness but till we truly experience them how can we know them

[Sun Jan 08 09:24:07 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

We ARE different levels of consciousness. We just need to tune in, rather than tuning out. It's what you said about being honest, not disconnected from ourselves

[Sun Jan 08 09:24:40 PST 2006] Cool_Dude

Taking responsibility does not mean judging or attacking other people!

[Sun Jan 08 09:25:06 PST 2006] Vic

Maybe it's all about studying

[Sun Jan 08 09:25:07 PST 2006] ardis(Q)

You chew 200 times, practice deep breathing and chant.

[Sun Jan 08 09:25:07 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Yes, we know....be personal with all this. How does it help you? What does it give you?

[Sun Jan 08 09:25:43 PST 2006] sandra(Q)

Food is just one part...how we think, how we chew, what we do, how we think is all a reflection of our reality.

[Sun Jan 08 09:25:43 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

So, then, what is health?

[Sun Jan 08 09:26:05 PST 2006] Vic

Balance

[Sun Jan 08 09:26:21 PST 2006] Cool_Dude

We don't get peace by enforcing control over other, instead by practicing a peaceful life!

[Sun Jan 08 09:27:11 PST 2006] LInda(Q)

Vic, I moved to Mexico recently, and it is very difficult to find good quality food....in New York was all over the place

[Sun Jan 08 09:27:11 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Yes, in Israel too, there is much less available than in NY. Health, to me, means that everything is OK. Less food, more food, comfort, discomfort....everything is truly OK. Total flexibility.

[Sun Jan 08 09:28:47 PST 2006] Vic

Perhaps if good quality food is not available where you live you will have to mail order it - that's what I had to do years ago, luckily times have changed.

[Sun Jan 08 09:30:32 PST 2006] klara(Q)

if everything is ok, where do goals come in?

[Sun Jan 08 09:30:32 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Nice! We have goals--say, health--and it's ok if they are fulfilled or not. Can you really embrace this idea?

[Sun Jan 08 09:27:37 PST 2006] sandra

Health is feeling good, feeling joy and confident that we can meet our daily demands.

[Sun Jan 08 09:28:08 PST 2006] lillian(Q)

we are all human beings..nothing can make you pure, clean and exempt from illness.. It is more about what you do if you get sick, how you deal with it, what tools you rather use and what your instinct tells you..learning to be in touch with oneself is quite a challenge for me every day

[Sun Jan 08 09:28:08 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

This is a nice comment. Yes, even spiritual people get ill. Why is this?

[Sun Jan 08 09:28:17 PST 2006] Borya

yes, if you are happy your are probably healthy

[Sun Jan 08 09:29:26 PST 2006] chatcat27(Q)

So what causes illness or disease - It's not just about the food / diet; it's all the components, is it not?

[Sun Jan 08 09:29:41 PST 2006] sandra

I believe it all starts in our minds. How we use what we have is our choice.

[Sun Jan 08 09:29:55 PST 2006] Mamie(Q)

Then even illness could fit the overall picture of health--yes?

[Sun Jan 08 09:29:26 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Now you're getting it! So what do we need to do to integrate all these many componants..to be honest and whole?

[Sun Jan 08 09:29:55 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Wonderful insight! I have a friend whose body is still ill, but she is healed. Can this be?

[Sun Jan 08 09:31:48 PST 2006] klara(Q)

because she accepts her illness?? So what does being ill mean??

[Sun Jan 08 09:31:48 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Here's my definition of health: Balance. Illness then is imbalance. It's as simple as that.

[Sun Jan 08 09:30:49 PST 2006] klara(Q)

Isn't arrogance the biggest illness? Isn't it arrogant to think we can control everything about our bodies??

[Sun Jan 08 09:30:49 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Absolutely

[Sun Jan 08 09:31:14 PST 2006] jane(Q)

Is the purpose of life to be healthy?

[Sun Jan 08 09:31:14 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Is it for you? Isn't health a means to a bigger goal?

[Sun Jan 08 09:31:53 PST 2006] Cool_Dude

Osawa ate potatoes in prison, poor quality food. Did it benefit him? Was he healthy? He almost lost his eyesight from that experience!

[Sun Jan 08 09:32:40 PST 2006] klara(Q)

so why are we trying? I mean aren't we trying?

[Sun Jan 08 09:32:40 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Deepak Chopra calls trying a cultural virus. We really get the most done when we are the stillest and deepest, like the organization of the cosmos, still and silent.

[Sun Jan 08 09:32:48 PST 2006] LInda(C)

Ginat, being personal about this, taking full responsibility gives me total freedom

[Sun Jan 08 09:33:00 PST 2006] chatcat27

So we can correct the imbalance once recognized.

[Sun Jan 08 09:34:38 PST 2006] chatcat27(Q)

It's about practice. It's the lifestyle. Is your friend healed? I want to know why spiritual people get ill. I want to know why someone who follows the diet to a T gets ill. Is there an answer forthcoming?

[Sun Jan 08 09:34:38 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

OK, let's get down to it. We can call my friend healed, or we can call her sick. The same for Michio. Spiritual people, like all people, get sick because there is some imbalance inherent in life. So they reach a bump and have to get over it. Next, we have to ask what it means to practice to a T....

[Sun Jan 08 09:35:12 PST 2006] lillian(C)

I am going through a breast cancer experience right now... I have chosen not to do the regular therapies, I refused chemotherapy and radio therapy and I have had to confront a lot of fear of not following the rules "established". I rather decided to do alternative things like changing my eating habits, and paying close attention to my body and my needs.. Just like when doctors think they have the truth and the power to predict an outcome, following "anything that makes you feel you are "above and over it all" is as tricky and dangerous

[Sun Jan 08 09:35:59 PST 2006] Cool_Dude

everyone who walks someplace is balanced until they can't walk anymore! Walking and running are balancing actions! Falling down is due to imbalance! And eventually everyone reaches that point!

[Sun Jan 08 09:36:05 PST 2006] klara(Q)

so can you be balanced if your body is in disease??

[Sun Jan 08 09:36:05 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

The body and the mind are one, yet respond at different rates. So yes, you can be balanced and still diseased, or imbalanced without physical symptoms (yet). What indeed is balance?

[Sun Jan 08 09:36:33 PST 2006] Vic(C)

Linda, I like that - taking full responsibility gives me total freedom

[Sun Jan 08 09:36:46 PST 2006] jane(C)

I think the purpose of life is to do good in the world, and health is helpful, but not necessary.

[Sun Jan 08 09:37:17 PST 2006] GINAT

So, what is balance?

[Sun Jan 08 09:37:47 PST 2006] GINAT

It's clearly not a static state of being...

[Sun Jan 08 09:38:00 PST 2006] GINAT

Is balance happiness?

[Sun Jan 08 09:38:05 PST 2006] Cool_Dude

Vic, taking total responsibility for you, gives you total freedom but what about taking total freedom for others?

[Sun Jan 08 09:39:06 PST 2006] klara(Q)

I like what Jane said yet am still confused. Don't we all want to be healthy? Free of disease?

[Sun Jan 08 09:39:06 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

No, being free of disease is not the biggest purpose. Michio knew what he was creating. His goals were different than his health.

[Sun Jan 08 09:39:15 PST 2006] chatcat27

Balance - diet, sunlight, sleep, meditation, emotions, etc. Not extremes but balance.

[Sun Jan 08 09:39:36 PST 2006] chatcat27

We need contrast to know.

[Sun Jan 08 09:39:50 PST 2006] LInda(Q)

Ginat, balance is moving up and down staying close to the center.....not major up and down jumps

[Sun Jan 08 09:39:50 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

No, this is being centered. Even Evil Keneival was balanced.

[Sun Jan 08 09:41:04 PST 2006] GINAT

How do we achieve balance? Macrobiotics provides us the key--right under our noses. And, yes, our minds, in understanding yin and yang.

[Sun Jan 08 09:41:22 PST 2006] lillian(C)

balance is learning to use your mind, food, support, etc.. to achieve a state of well being wherever you are. It is not a goal, it is a path..Like happiness is not a state but a condition

[Sun Jan 08 09:41:35 PST 2006] klara(Q)

I don't think balance and happiness are the same. Balance is going back and forth amongst different states, so sometimes happiness, sometimes sadness

[Sun Jan 08 09:41:35 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Bravo

[Sun Jan 08 09:42:28 PST 2006] Vic(Q)

That's an automatic - when you take total responsibility for yourself - - that's all you really need to do right now

[Sun Jan 08 09:42:28 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Yes, but....can you give a personal example? Let's get practical a bit. People still want to heal serious illnesses.

[Sun Jan 08 09:42:57 PST 2006] klara(Q)

Balance--anything can be thrown at you and you don't fall?

[Sun Jan 08 09:42:57 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

No, sometimes you do fall. THEN you get back up. I fell.

[Sun Jan 08 09:44:13 PST 2006] chatcat27(Q)

It certainly is a path but does that mean that's the answer to: If imbalance causes dis-ease than how to we achieve and maintain balance. Is there a secret.

[Sun Jan 08 09:44:13 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

I like your direct questions. Yes, there is a secret, and as I said it's under your nose and above your eyebrows--our mouth and our minds. Ohsawa said: theory without practice is useless and practice without theory is dangerous.

[Sun Jan 08 09:44:26 PST 2006] sarelsen

so the very first sentence on the back of my copy of kushi's the macrobiotic way is: "More than 40 years ago, Michio Kushi recognized that improper diet was a principal cause of many illnesses, including cancer. " macrobiotics is definitely "sold" as a disease prevention/cure. is this false advertising

[Sun Jan 08 09:46:02 PST 2006] chatcat27(Q)

How did you fall Ginat?

[Sun Jan 08 09:46:02 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Chatcat, thanks for a practical question. After 20 years of macrobiotic practice, and even counseling others to health, I developed breast cancer. It threw me for a loop. I went deep inside to heal it, and learned a ton. You can read my story on our website if you like--www.TheRiceHouse.com. Wait a bit, we're still under construction.

[Sun Jan 08 09:46:30 PST 2006] Vic(Q)

The strongest of all of us are the ones the fall and get back up again, so, you, Ginat, are the strength of our group.

[Sun Jan 08 09:46:30 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Thank you....thank you

[Sun Jan 08 09:46:49 PST 2006] lillian(C)

Learning to be flexible with life's uncertainties and knowing you are not in control of your life, as if you are untouchable if you do this or the other, or safe if you follow this diet..are two main issues I am facing with my breast cancer and my choices..

[Sun Jan 08 09:48:03 PST 2006] Cool_Dude(Q)

Ginat, isn't balance a constantly changing state?

[Sun Jan 08 09:48:03 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Of course it is. That means that we are constantly changing. This is the state of health--flexibility. Everything's ok. This is nature. We have desires and we let them go just as easily. Ohsawa's mantra was, "Everything's ok." Can you really mean that? Can you say yes to everything???

[Sun Jan 08 09:49:22 PST 2006] Vic(Q)

What has been stated before in macrobiotic literature was the fact that Michio and Herman were oriental and this diet that they brought to the US was not for Americans - it was too yang.

[Sun Jan 08 09:49:22 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Perhaps...so we've changed and evolved. Israeli macrobiotics is not the same as, say, Australia . Today I eat differently than I did yesterday. Now I am yang, tomorrow perhaps I'll be yin. So I flow...

[Sun Jan 08 09:49:40 PST 2006] Mamie(C)

Isn't is Rainier Marie Rilke who said, We learn to live the questions and we may someday live our way to the answers?

[Sun Jan 08 09:50:51 PST 2006] klara(Q)

I feel great resistance to say yes to anger, hurtfulness, and other negative emotions. I feel I don't want them in my life.

[Sun Jan 08 09:50:51 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Your honesty is always so very refreshing, Klara. Hat's off. Practice saying yes to hurt, to unwelcome events, to "negativity." Then it's not negative. Say yes to life. It's quite a discipline.

[Sun Jan 08 09:51:02 PST 2006] Vic(C)

Yes, going with flow - as Michio always says "Please enjoy:

[Sun Jan 08 09:51:38 PST 2006] Cool_Dude(Q)

Also isn't constant and change both components of everything, like yang and yin?

[Sun Jan 08 09:51:38 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Constancy and change...nice. The only constant is change...far out, cool dude!

[Sun Jan 08 09:52:44 PST 2006] LInda(Q)

Ginat, I must accept that I am not that flexible, truly, deep in my heart I can not say YES to everything

[Sun Jan 08 09:52:44 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Your honesty is the first step there. There's no where else to begin other than where you are. We can all do it. The magic ingredient--our diet. It's what everyone else forgets when they want to be spiritual.

[Sun Jan 08 09:53:35 PST 2006] jane(Q)

My impression is that even in the macrobiotic literature, it is important to have a connection with some larger force outside yourself.

[Sun Jan 08 09:53:35 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Absolutely. THAT is the point of wellness, or perhaps we can say that that is wellness. Being connected. Being whole.

[Sun Jan 08 09:54:00 PST 2006] mikef(C)

Balance is a result of proper energy input into our mind/body/spirit. Most critical source is the food we eat but we also get from other sources around us - sun, radiation, weather, seasons, etc. The challenge is feeling when all are in sync. Getting ill is missing some aspect of keeping balanced. Illness tells us that we need to examine our daily life activities to see where we slipped off to too yin or too yang

[Sun Jan 08 09:54:10 PST 2006] sandra

Separation....the belief that we stand alone is a major function of imbalance. Knowledge that we are all connected through infinite and universal mind is to court balance. Is Yin and Yang balance perhaps knowing we are one part of one whole?

[Sun Jan 08 09:54:38 PST 2006] lillian(Q)

I can only say "everything is ok" on a daily basis... sometimes not the whole day... but that makes me wonder when I will embrace it all as ok..It is quite a chllenge..Taking an illness as an opportunity to redefine a life.. and an opportunity to grow.. Knowing nothing is permanent and that is ok...life and death dancing together.. Death of old habits,

[Sun Jan 08 09:54:38 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

You are balanced all the time...just sometimes you forget.

[Sun Jan 08 09:55:10 PST 2006] chatcat27(Q)

I got out of the chatroom when I went to read your story. I merely scanned it since I didn't really want to leave the chat room. I will read your story later, however what I am picking up on is that it's certainly not just diet, it's like the spokes of a wheel and if one's broken it effects the integrity of the whole. There are lots of components, clearly our emotional health is one.

[Sun Jan 08 09:55:29 PST 2006] ardis(Q)

"Everything's OK" That sounds like a good antidote to one of modern man's dilemmas: stress, which they are finding causes a lot of illness.

[Sun Jan 08 09:55:29 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Stress is what, yin or yang?

[Sun Jan 08 09:55:57 PST 2006] chatcat27

yang?

[Sun Jan 08 09:59:33 PST 2006] ardis(Q)

In mb terms stress would be yang, extreme concentrated energy, totally off balance. Stress is countered with extreme yin in modern culture: drugs, alcohol, sugar.

[Sun Jan 08 09:57:23 PST 2006] chatcat27(Q)

How to find balance if we don't know out-of-balance.

[Sun Jan 08 09:57:23 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

You know. You are unhappy, unwell, un-whatever. And if you don't know, don't worry. Just wait. It will get worse. Eventually it becomes physical, and then we know for sure. Then we have to go inward to find the glitch, and allow it so we can face it.

[Sun Jan 08 09:59:33 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

You are all right--stress is a yang factor, although not necessarily totally off-balance...maybe just a bit. Some stress can be helpful even to get us going. I have stress now answering all these great comments, and I'm feeling great. I couldn't keep it up all night though.

[Sun Jan 08 10:00:32 PST 2006] chatcat27

You are doing excellent. This is a great forum. Thank you.

[Sun Jan 08 10:00:43 PST 2006] Cool_Dude(Q)

Again are you talking about stress being the cause or the product (yin or yang)?

[Sun Jan 08 10:00:43 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

We are talking macrobiotic terms here--stress is a yang factor, creating a yang condition. clear?

[Sun Jan 08 10:00:56 PST 2006] lillian(C)

I think gratitude helps me find balance more than any other thing

[Sun Jan 08 10:04:45 PST 2006] sandra

Lillian, I too find gratitude to be a source of satisfaction. Helps the bumps smooth out.

[Sun Jan 08 10:05:40 PST 2006] klara

Gratitude is better than any medicine doctors have yet to fine. Puts you in a different consciousness of everything

[Sun Jan 08 10:06:06 PST 2006] Vic

Yes, gratitude, I'm glad you brought that up Lillian, being thankful for everything in our lives help

[Sun Jan 08 10:06:23 PST 2006] LInda(C)

Sandra and Lillian: When I changed my anger to Gratitude, my whole existence changed

[Sun Jan 08 10:06:23 PST 2006] sarelsen(Q)

are you saying happy=balanced/unhappy=unbalanced?

[Sun Jan 08 10:06:23 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Yes. Do you agree?

[Sun Jan 08 10:06:48 PST 2006] sandra

There is a wonderful online site : GoGratitude. It is very uplifting. Also she sends you little reminders on how gratitude changes you..

[Sun Jan 08 10:07:00 PST 2006] lillian(Q)

It even helps to see the bumps as chances to grow...

[Sun Jan 08 10:07:00 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Indeed

[Sun Jan 08 10:07:11 PST 2006] Vic(C)

Yes, gratitude, I'm glad you brought that up, Lillian, being thankful for everything in our lives helps

[Sun Jan 08 10:07:47 PST 2006] GINAT

Have we answered the question? Is there any unfinished business? Why do "macrobiotic" people get sick?

[Sun Jan 08 10:08:17 PST 2006] GINAT

I think it's because they lack balance on some level. They still have challenges, like everyone.

[Sun Jan 08 10:08:31 PST 2006] lillian

because we can never have a 100 % balance

[Sun Jan 08 10:08:39 PST 2006] GINAT

And yes, their macrobiotic life style may be off. It's not everything, but it's a big part.

[Sun Jan 08 10:09:21 PST 2006] GINAT

In a sense, we all have 100% balance, meaning that we are all alive.

[Sun Jan 08 10:09:32 PST 2006] sandra

Macrobiotic people get sick because we rely on something outside of ourselves. It all starts on the inside...our thoughts create our reality. Fear, number one devil.

[Sun Jan 08 10:10:03 PST 2006] GINAT

Yes, Gerald Jampolsky says there are two emotions--love and fear.

[Sun Jan 08 10:11:17 PST 2006] Vic

There are so many great macrobiotic articles/workshops, pamphlets, etc... that are old and out of print, but oh so informative and interesting to study - hopefully they are still available out there.?

[Sun Jan 08 10:11:20 PST 2006] Gary(Q)

do you feel that there is a big role for macrobiotic counselors to guide us to balance

[Sun Jan 08 10:11:20 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

I'm so glad you asked this. This is the main thrust of my counseling and guiding. It is essential. I teach cooking, and I teach how to feel, to think, to allow.

[Sun Jan 08 10:11:40 PST 2006] klara(C)

Wasn't fear learned? Doesn't it need to be unlearned?

[Sun Jan 08 10:12:31 PST 2006] chatcat27(Q)

For me, definitely one of the keys is to be in a nurturing environment and practice, practice, meditation and diet.

[Sun Jan 08 10:12:31 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Yes, this helps. Then we need to slowly learn to maintain it when conditions are harder. My students always have access to me for encouragement and support.

[Sun Jan 08 10:13:19 PST 2006] lillian

I think we are all human beings and we are here to learn, even if we are balanced because we are alive, you are human you go thru all emotions and states of mind and you would be perfect and therefore not human if you had all factors in control . the only language we understand that promotes change

[Sun Jan 08 10:13:33 PST 2006] Cool_Dude(Q)

One famous macrobiotic cooking teacher, cookbook writer, loved by many was said to binge on fried bread!

[Sun Jan 08 10:13:33 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

There's a good issue. Our beloved teacher ate jelly doughnuts. It was his choice for what he wanted to create in his life. We are free beings, thank God

[Sun Jan 08 10:13:38 PST 2006] sandra

I think we have to be vigilant of our thoughts. Our conscious mind must be the watchdog of what we interpret as truth

[Sun Jan 08 10:13:44 PST 2006] LInda(C)

Fear is learned Klara, and I think one way to unlearn it is by having our liver, and our kidneys working properly

[Sun Jan 08 10:13:56 PST 2006] LInda(C)

Yes Sandra, I agree that our thoughts create our reality......and what goes inside our mouths create part if not all of our thoughts

[Sun Jan 08 10:13:57 PST 2006] Pascal_Carlier

What for me has always been a key to joy, health and happiness is changing habits often. Always renewing yourself and enjoying different things...

[Sun Jan 08 10:14:57 PST 2006] chatcat27(C)

The secret or answer to live in nurturing place must start from the inside. We all need compassion. Letting go and healing of the fears and anger -- yes learned. Yes, I agree to, our thoughts create our reality.

[Sun Jan 08 10:15:30 PST 2006] sandra

Linda, I totally agree that what goes in creates our environment. Thoughts, food, experience, lifestyle.

[Sun Jan 08 10:16:36 PST 2006] GINAT

I think we've learned a lot from each other tonight. It's a great supportive group. We have a wonderful support group here in Jerusalem . It's so important.

[Sun Jan 08 10:17:14 PST 2006] GINAT

I met a man once who knew no other macrobiotic people, so he opened a free dinner party once a week at his home to attract people. It worked!

[Sun Jan 08 10:17:30 PST 2006] GINAT

Macrobiotics means always finding a way

[Sun Jan 08 10:17:53 PST 2006] Vic

Thank you, Ginat.

[Sun Jan 08 10:18:30 PST 2006] Pascal_Carlier

I like that one (macrobiotics means always finding a way). Thanks Ginat, P.

[Sun Jan 08 10:20:19 PST 2006] Cool_Dude(Q)

Maybe feeding your unfriendly neighbors will bring true peace to your region!

[Sun Jan 08 10:20:19 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Insha'alah!

[Sun Jan 08 10:18:38 PST 2006] klara(Q)

If all is to be accepted, then what do you do with thoughts you think cause dis-ease?

[Sun Jan 08 10:18:38 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Look at them. Choose them. Release them. Allow them. ...

[Sun Jan 08 10:19:16 PST 2006] LInda(C)

If any of you know people in Mexico , please let me know. I am trying to make a support group over here.

[Sun Jan 08 10:19:58 PST 2006] sandra(Q)

What is the best way to learn Yin and Yang?

[Sun Jan 08 10:19:58 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

in my opinion, there are three ways. 1. Study with a teacher. 2. Read books. 3. Sit quietly and meditate.

[Sun Jan 08 10:20:22 PST 2006] Pascal_Carlier

4. go out and dance

[Sun Jan 08 10:21:01 PST 2006] LInda(Q)

Ginat, for me this has been a great support group. Thank for you for your commitment, love and energy

[Sun Jan 08 10:21:01 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Thank you all. It's a love fest. Macrobiotics is such a gift to the world. We thank our jelly doughnut leader.

[Sun Jan 08 10:21:14 PST 2006] chatcat27

Thanks Ginat for this opportunity.

[Sun Jan 08 10:21:39 PST 2006] Gary

Thanks for making our first Sunday chat so perfect!

[Sun Jan 08 09:56:01 PST 2006] Cool_Dude(Q)

Ginat, will Rice House also include your research project?

[Sun Jan 08 09:56:01 PST 2006] GINAT(A)

Absolutely. It's going to be an amazing site. I hope to make it a living macro directory.

[Sun Jan 08 10:22:20 PST 2006] sandra

I look forward to seeing your site when it's done. Blessings to all. and Thank you Ginat.

[Sun Jan 08 10:22:36 PST 2006] klara

It was a pleasure sharing with all of you, and Ginat, what's left to say. We love you.

[Sun Jan 08 10:23:18 PST 2006] GINAT

I am compiling a book of interviews by people who have gotten ill and then healed. It's a powerful work.

[Sun Jan 08 10:23:43 PST 2006] Gary

Let's join back here next week for a general chat

[Sun Jan 08 10:24:14 PST 2006] GINAT

Thank you everyone. I had a wonderful time. See you all next week!